Caught red-handed (well sort of...)

[domill]

I'd like to have your opinion about something "funny" that happened to me recently

While going through profiles of bi guys on another website, I saw an interesting picture...
Although it was a bit blurred, I definitely recognised one of my colleagues.

He's not exactly the most "straight acting" guy in the world, so I guess I wasn't that surprised. Anyway he's clearly not out.

But then a couple of days later, at an office drinks, I heard him telling a story about how a guy was hitting on him in a rather aggressive way, and how he just "wanted to punch the fucking faggot". And then kept going about how disgusting it is, etc.

I didn' say anything but was dying to tell him "Well, I'm confused, I thought you liked it up the arse?!" (his profile leaves very little room to the imagination). I didn't do anything, because it wouldn't have been very constructive, but I choked on my beer for a couple of minutes.

I can understand that he's not out, -neither am I-, and that he wants people to believe that he's straight, blah blah blah. But that was a bit over the top.

How would you have reacted?

[rissababynta]

i probably would have had a good laugh at that.

well, i am the type of person that finds it hard to let things go. if he was just making little comments i would probably have just ignored it even though inside i'd be screaming "I KNOW YOUR SECRET DAMN IT"! but since he was a little over the top, i would have not been able to hold back, and i would have approached him about it. not in front of everyone of course. must still have respect!

overall though, i think you handled it well, especially since you understand where he is coming from not being out yourself.

[bohemian69]

I probaly would have reacted the same way - wanting to say something in front of his friends - but biting my tongue.
It really sounds like he is afraid of coming out. I would guess to say that his friends probally agreed with him, when he told them about how he wanted to punch the other guy that hit on him. (Then again, they're probally secretly jealous because no one hit on them)
But he is certainly over compensating by trying to act like "The Straight Guy".

[domill]

Yeah, the trade off between "I know where you come from" and "you hypocritical bastard" was a tough one...

But it's been a couple of weeks now, and I keep laughing about it...

[domill]

I probaly would have reacted the same way - wanting to say something in front of his friends - but biting my tongue.
It really sounds like he is afraid of coming out. I would guess to say that his friends probally agreed with him, when he told them about how he wanted to punch the other guy that hit on him. (Then again, they're probally secretly jealous because no one hit on them)
But he is certainly over compensating by trying to act like "The Straight Guy".

The thing is: his friends were not even that aggressive about it. One of them just gave him a pat on the shoulder and said "but that's because you're a good looking guy"

[arana]

If I were absolutely positive it was the same person as the profile I might have gone up and whispered something in his ear to the effect of: "Your *such and such* profile didn't say you were into S&M too". Then he'd know that at least one person knew he was a hypocrite but not humiliating him totally to a crowd.

[arana]

The thing is: his friends were not even that aggressive about it. One of them just gave him a pat on the shoulder and said "but that's because you're a good looking guy"
Maybe he was trying to prove to his friends that he's not because they already know and/or treat him like he is and he wants to "fit in" with them more.

[Skater Boy]

If you wanted to be REALLY mean, you could print out numerous copies of his profile page and pin them up all over the office (or wherever you work). Or get one made up into a T-shirt and wear it to the next social gathering he'll be at.

But that would be evil. I'm sure the guy's just trying to fit in. even if that means over-compensating for his own sexuality by playing homophobic. I know... I've been there.

Don't you work in finance? My brother works in finance, and he says the people aren't particularly open-minded...

[JoyJoyHollywood]

Well, to me the thing is this. Where I am the straight men are very hyper masculine. They really go to extremes in order to be perceived as tough. I've seen guys stand around in front of a industrial steel door and slam their heads against it to open it and see who can move it the farthest.

But I also know that most of these guys feel horrible because they can't really show their girlfriends, family or friends a lot of affection because to them, it will make them weak. Inside, they feel like dog (expletive).

So, I can't but help and feel a lot of pity for them. To live like that? With that frustration, fear and represion? It must be very....well, it must really suck.

And to be a man who's homosexual and he's this repressed also? So that he is behaving with this much hyper masculinity? It must be a contant inner battle and cause a lot of turmoil

So, if that happened to me I would probably say very calmly "I don't have a problem with gay guys. In fact I know a few and they have never hassled me or anyone else I know. They probably wouldn't care enough to hassle you either. Now, why don't you just relax a little, okay?"

[biwords]

I lose sympathy for anyone who uses expressions like "I'd like to punch the fucking faggot", whatever their internal conflicts must be like. I wouldn't have outed him, but I'd probably have taken him aside and explained why, especially in the circumstances, that was not an appropriate thing to say. But of course, it would also be perfectly acceptable to just let it pass -- you don't have to take on the task of straightening out other people's neuroses.

[Skater Boy]

I lose sympathy for anyone who uses expressions like "I'd like to punch the fucking faggot", whatever their internal conflicts must be like. I wouldn't have outed him, but I'd probably have taken him aside and explained why, especially in the circumstances, that was not an appropriate thing to say. But of course, it would also be perfectly acceptable to just let it pass -- you don't have to take on the task of straightening out other people's neuroses.

Well, if the other people around him were equally homophobic, I could understand it. I grew up around heteros, and words like "faggot" (or "fag" to abbreviate) were used daily without even thinking. Sometimes not in a sexual context, but other times definitely so. And violent imagery is prevalent among many youngsters these days. I would say that in my younger (and less sexually aware) days, I probably even used the term myself a few times. Out of ignorance, perhaps, but ignorance is popular in many hetero social circles, and "When in Rome..."

Anyway, one *hopes* that other peoples' attitudes towards these issues changes as they get older, but thats not always the case.

According to Domill though, the other guys didn't seem to be that homophobic, so who knows what was going through the poor dude's head? But I guess if he really wanted people to know, he'd tell them himself.

[brudegan]

I would like to believe that I would never out anyone, regardless of their behavior. I would prefer to either ignore the offense, or find a discrete way to discuss the situation with the person.

Like I said, i would like to believe that is how I would deal with the situation.

In my younger days I am afraid that I might have called the person on their behavior in front of everyone. Then I would have had to deal with the guilt for any repercussions.

I can't control or change how any one else behaves. I can only try to control my own actions and reactions.

[domill]

you don't have to take on the task of straightening out other people's neuroses.

couldn't be more right.

Something else occured to me when reading your comments. Maybe it was the guy's way of saying "why the hell did that man think I would be interested? Does he think I'm gay? Do you all think I'm gay?"

In which case I just feel sorry for him.

I work in a very masculine, traditional and formal environment (finance). I suppose homosexuality is acceptable there, but sexual orientation is not discussed openly... there is a widely accepted "don't ask don't tell" policy. But I think most people are quite open-minded about it.

So when the guy made his homophobic comments, I think most people wondered why the hell he was being so aggressive.

[ghytifrdnr]

I guess my idea would to somehow get an anonymous note to him, mentioning his weblisting, and them telling him he's not making any points with his office attitude. The important thing would be to NOT expose yourself. A little paranoia can have a wonderful moderating effect on people like him. ;)

[TaylorMade]

I'd take him aside privately, tell him my suspicions and say that it's not required to act like that. The main thing is not to drive him deeper into shame OR to shame him publicly, because honestly, some people can't take that kind of exposure.

Call me overly compassionate, but I'd want him to feel like he doesn't have to use that kind of language and make himself into something he's not deep down.

*Taylor*

[rayosytruenos]

[...] While going through profiles of bi guys on another website, I saw an interesting picture...
Although it was a bit blurred, I definitely recognised one of my colleagues.

He's not exactly the most "straight acting" guy in the world, so I guess I wasn't that surprised. Anyway he's clearly not out.

But then a couple of days later, at an office drinks, I heard him telling a story about how a guy was hitting on him in a rather aggressive way, and how he just "wanted to punch the fucking faggot". And then kept going about how disgusting it is, etc.[...] Hi, Domill!
It would have depended on how distended the meeting was, but for what you said in a later post, it seems that the other colleagues were rather non-aggressive, so it seems that you could have said a comment defending/asking for understanding or respect for gays, with no need to out him, at least not in public...

Depending on the situation, that's what I do... If the situation is too aggressive (meaning that they are too closed-minded at that time that they cannot listen to any reason), I just let it go, but if the situation is a bit more friendly, although still going against gays, I usually say some comment. The other day I was with 2 of my friends, one man and one woman. The man (he is already old, so I think I cannot change his mindset) had already said to me while watching a program (that looking for Joseph musical contest for those in the UK) with about other 7 people from work, that this and that and that and that were gay, so I asked him if he had had sex with them to know it (that did shut his mouth up), on another day that his mother is very happy because all her sons are healthy, honest people and not gays, so I said something like I'd prefer to be gay than to have an illness. But on this occassion my female friend said in his presence that to be gay was an abomination in the eyes of God, so I said that if she believes in God, she knows that everyone is a creation of God and as a creation of God, everyone is perfect, that she is no one to think higher than God Himself, and that He might have created gays as a means to control the overpopulation in the world, as the gays are not usually going to procreate, and I went on giving her some examples of the animal kingdom where in overpopulated or underpopulated environments, certain species are capable to change sex to keep the species going on and keeping it alive...

If you speak to him in private, I guess you would out yourself too to him, and I'm not sure if he would use that information to harm you in some ways (he could quickly delete his profile and hide himself even more in his closet).

All the best,

ray

[rayosytruenos]

I guess my idea would to somehow get an anonymous note to him, mentioning his weblisting, and them telling him he's not making any points with his office attitude. The important thing would be to NOT expose yourself. A little paranoia can have a wonderful moderating effect on people like him. ;)I agree, maybe he could create an e-mail account just to send him an e-mail to him showing that somebody knows about his double standards...

[rayosytruenos]

Well, if the other people around him were equally homophobic, I could understand it. I grew up around heteros, and words like "faggot" (or "fag" to abbreviate) were used daily without even thinking. Sometimes not in a sexual context, but other times definitely so. And violent imagery is prevalent among many youngsters these days. I would say that in my younger (and less sexually aware) days, I probably even used the term myself a few times. Out of ignorance, perhaps, but ignorance is popular in many hetero social circles, and "When in Rome..."[...]As I said, it depends on the situation. I'm not out myself and I can join in a joke about homosexuals... You have to admit that some are funny...

I'm also teasing some overmacho attitude blokes at work. I guess I'm sort of a mystery to them, as I don't brag about what girls from work I've bedded, (actually if they themselves speak about it and then somebody asks me if it is true, I say something like "Really? If she said so, it's her business what she wants to say. Either if I confirm it or deny it, you just have made your mind up, so it's none of my business."), I guess they think I could be gay, as some have said to me in the locker room, "don't get too close to my arse" to what I jokingly say "why? I thought you love it up your arse."

[scubaman]

I think I would have quickly thought of a way to use either his screen name or the name of the site in a normal conversation while starring him straight in the eyes. That way he would have known you were on to him without outting him and yourself in public and to covey to him at least one person is on to his B.S. :2cents:

[NaughtyNorm]

I have one line that I love to use on such people.
"At least someone wants you".
I have used it many times to change the subject or attitude of the conversation...
It's usually meet with humor and when it isn't, fuck M'.
:cool:

[rissababynta]

I think I would have quickly thought of a way to use either his screen name or the name of the site in a normal conversation while starring him straight in the eyes. That way he would have known you were on to him without outting him and yourself in public and to covey to him at least one person is on to his B.S. :2cents:



i did the something similar to my husband. before we started dating, he sent me an email from a personals site without realizing that i was the chick he worked with everyday. so the next day at work i started calling him by his screen name. he was totally thrown off and after he caught on we had a big laugh about it. helped break the ice for our relationship.

that being said, i probably should have thought about this when i made the previous post. i think i would have had a lot more fun letting him know that i know this way haha.